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Future Christians on Homosexuality

If you were to take a poll of Christians from 1700 years ago, I bet that about 95-98 percent of those polled probably couldn’t have a problem with slavery. If that same poll were taken 1000 years ago, the results probably wouldn’t change all that much. 200 years ago, that number would probably be closer to 70 percent however. And during the Civil War, it would have probably been about 50 percent. Of course today that number would probably be close to zero. I think someone would be hard pressed to find anyone willing to admit that they think slavery is morally okay in today’s society.

If we asked all those Christians we have imaginarily polled why they supported slavery, they would no doubt tell us that it was in the Bible. And if we polled those who opposed slavery, they too would tell us that their beliefs were biblical in nature. But the purpose of today’s blog isn’t to debate slavery and it certainly isn’t to debate whether or not slavery is supported in the Bible or not. My point here is that Christians once believed that it was supported by the Bible and so Christian opinion about slavery has in fact shifted. Many Christians today will claim that those Christians in the past who supported slavery either weren’t real Christians or didn’t properly understand what God was saying.

If we polled Christians 1700 years ago about homosexuality, most people wouldn’t even know what we were even talking about. But those that did would almost certainly be against it. In fact, we wouldn’t even see a shift in the percentage of Christians who are against homosexuality until sometime toward the end of the last century. Now, it is probably about 60-40 against homosexuality among modern Christians and I am being generous to the pro-homosexuality Christians in that number.

The thing is that that number is changing. More and more Christians are accepting of homosexuality, homosexuals, and even homosexual marriage. In fact, following that trend, we can look into the future and see that the Christians of the future might look back at those Christians today who stand against gay marriage and consider homosexuality a sin and claim that those Christians weren’t real Christians or didn’t properly understand what God was saying.

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  • Aidan Maslow

    I was actually making this exact same point last night when I was finishing up a chapter in my first book. Historically the evidence is there that the religious communities of the times where all split. Both groups, for and against — whether it be slavery, race equality or gender equality — insisted that their side was in the moral right, according to the bible. Homosexuality will be no different, it will go before the Supreme Court and they will rule that it is unconstitutional to deny homosexuals the same rights as everyone else (14th Amendment). Within a generation the majority of society will fall in line and everyone from then on will insist that homosexuality is moral, according to the bible!

  • ProgRockGirl

    I think before gay rights really became publicized, homosexuality just wasn’t on people’s minds as much and didn’t occur to them. In past centuries (and in other cultures) friendships could be much more affectionate and intimate without people becoming suspicious (“romantic friendship” used to exist, now it really doesn’t). Having really close friends is often lacking in our society and maybe it’s b/c people are afraid it would seem gay (not that I blame gay rights for that, although some people do) although it could also just be that it’s not a sociological norm.
    I asked people of older generations about what things were like before gay rights. I got the feeling that an allegedly gay person would be whispered about but a lot of people would still associate with him/her. Then again most of the older people I know are not very conservative. It seems that a lot of groups were tolerated as long as they “knew their place”, but once groups wanted to be treated equally, more hostility came out (again, that doesn’t mean it’s the groups’ “fault” for trying to have rights). The book “Perfect Enemies” was about how the rise of the religious right coincided with the rise of gay rights.

  • Kat

    I don’t think that number is quite yet zero, unfortunatly…I know of a few ,in fact too many so called “christian” people who are so bigoted and so predjudiced, they STILL think blacks should be slaves.We saw in the last election how bigoted people still are.
    There are still people that think a woman’s place is in the home, being a housewife and mother. I hate to put them all in one group but I have a good idea, these are also the same people who are against homosexuality too…as long as you have people that believe in the teachings of the bible, word for word…things will never change.

  • http://superconcepts.poweressence.com/ Maxwell Jennings

    And after gays are finally accepted, maybe atheists will be too.

  • http://myspace.com/blackhawk089 Matt

    Wow wow wow. I can completely agree with you on the issue of slavery, and issues such as this that are never empirically stated by scripture are subject to change by Christians based on society. That simply makes sense. However, to compare this to homosexuality and draw the conclusion that in the future Christians will look back and say those who were against it weren’t real Christians is a huge stretch. Simply because the Bible is extremely clear on God’s position on homosexuality, while on the topic of slavery, is more vague.

    The Bible is not completely silent on slavery, but when it is mentioned the heart of the slave is always addressed not the moral implications of one man owning another.

    The most controversial verse is of course Romans 1:26-27. A former classmate of mine who “came out” after highschool explained to me that these verses are not a condemnation against homosexuality but rather a condemnation of those who are NOT homosexual, exchanging in homosexual behavior because of “peer pressure” or a pagan cult ritual. Another defense the homosexual’s bring against this verse is that in the context it is only talking about sex in the temple….but the main problem with this is that the Jews from this time all the way back to Moses were 100% against homosexuality and it was certainly not a secret. (This is 1 point were covenant theology comes in handy)

    In God’s covenant with the Jews we know that homosexuality was a serious sin (punishable by death) and since Christ merely changed the redemptive process by which we are saved morality has not.

    Anyways….I’m ranting, my point is simply your conclusion that future Christians may look back and condemn present Christians for condemning homosexuality is not a likely outcome since the Bible’s position on homosexuality is extremely clear. Even more so if one has an understanding of the cultural context, but even inside the text scripture is very clear….

  • http://myspace.com/blackhawk089 Matt

    The Christian must compromise scripture in order to accept homosexuality as moral in the eyes of God. From my experience the main thing that causes people to do this is because of the oppression they see some Christians displaying against the homosexual community. Which I am completely against, love the person not the sin….which I know you agree with staks since you’ve said time and time again how its not the Christian you have the problem with but out beliefs…sorta the same thing.

    Often times (especially younger Christians like myself) people begin accepting homosexuality as ok because they know gay’s or they simply would not know how to act if they made it known they were against homosexuality. I am almost always labeled as a judging person….however I simply try to make my beliefs reflect that which God has revealed to us through scripture. I am not being judgmental against the person but merely adhering to a belief that God DOES condemn the lifestyle. However, the finger is usually pointed at me for being “intolerant” or “Close minded.”

    • http://www.dangeroustalk.net Staks

      Zeus tells me that all non-Greeks are evil. I don’t think all non-Greeks are evil, but I obey my God, Zeus. You can’t blame your intolerance on your God. If your God is an evil hateful God, DON’T FOLLOW HIM!!!

      • http://myspace.com/blackhawk089 Matt

        Righteousness and hatred are two very different things.

        I really really find it funny that you often pick at me when I get off topic (which I have been trying not to do) from your blogs….but then when I make a direct response as to why I disagree with your conclusion….you avoid it. :-(

    • Robb

      Romans is not the word of God, it is the word of Paul; a Christian killing misogynist who tried to grow a conscience. This is your source of validation? That explains a lot…

  • Diana

    “compromise scripture”…scripture you say…sacred writings of a murderous thug…an imaginary murderous thug made up by the demented minds of ancient terrorists! Do you also believe if a man rapes a horse both the man and the horse should be killed? Do you believe that a woman who isn’t a virgin on her wedding night should be put to death….Homosexuality was not in the ten commandments and thus not very important to you imaginary friend…neither was rape, torture, bigotry, molestation, arrogance (you know that one pretty well, uh matt) or being a complete ignoramus. If it was so important to you imaginary friend why didn’t he write it on the “surprisingly missing” rocks he “wrote” the ten commandments on when he was a…burning bush…instead of wasting precious rock space on this:
    1. Do not worship other gods. (How self obsessed)
    2. Do not worship idols. (Again, it’s all about him)
    3. Do not misuse God’s name. (Again with the “he is so great” crap)
    4. Keep the Sabbath holy, you can’t work, nor your kids, wife, servants or strangers. (Again, “god” worried about himself)
    5. Honor your father & mother. (One good one so far…though if you have crappy parents hardly applicable…..you got 5 more to go)
    6. Do not murder. (Cool, a common sense one!)
    7. Do not commit adultery. (Yeah, that’s nice)
    8. Do not steal. (Yeah, of course…you need someone to spell it out for you?)
    9. Do not lie. (Common sense, no “god” needed…people must have been retarded back then)
    10. Do not covet they neighbor’s house, wife, man and maid servants, ox or ass….(so, I can’t admire anyone’s anything…or even acknowledge how nice it is)
    First four…all about him, the rest are common sense….I’m surprise one isn’t, thou must wash thy hand after taking big poo…common sense…still, I didn’t read anything about gayness…though, I feel silly arguing about a bunch of old writings that were found in a desert, picked through and then put into a crazy person’s best hits compilation that has been rewritten and rewritten about a hundred and one times according to each authors biases… seems silly to me

    • http://myspace.com/blackhawk089 Matt

      Wow….how old are you? So you know, when your tone is like this, people get so distracted by it that they basically ignore you. Do you know how I know this? Because I used to treat atheists the same way….didn’t work very well. After 8 years of yacking back and forth with people….I think it is much wiser to stay calm….joke around some….and debate respectfully. When you can do that….maybe I will check back this to reply lol….srry I be a busy young man!

  • Linda

    This blogger says..”More and more Christians are accepting of homosexuality, homosexuals, and even homosexual marriage.”

    Christians will never accept homosexuality which is an abomination to God.
    You have Christians confused with those who say they are Christians.
    Big difference!

    • http://www.dangeroustalk.net Staks

      Just covered that for the second time: http://www.dangeroustalk.net/?p=319

      • Linda

        Sin cannot be covered, it can be washed away in the precious blood of Christ.
        Blog until your fingers hurt, it doesn’t change what God said in the Torah.
        Homosexuality is a sin punishable by death.
        Nothing has changed.
        The wages of sin is death.
        Jesus never came to change the law, he came to fulfill it, in fact he added to it.
        I’m a Christian and will never accept the perversion homosexuals, it is from Satan.

        • http://www.dangeroustalk.net Staks

          And people ask me all the time why I care about the fiction of Christianity. You Linda are the reason. You hate every thing and everyone all in the name of God and Jesus. You literally demonize those you do not like claiming that gay people are “from Satan.” People like you are the reason why I blog.

  • http://wyoming89radio3.bravejournal.com marine corps marathon

    The Christian must compromise scripture in order to accept homosexuality as moral in the eyes of God. From my experience the main thing that causes people to do this is because of the oppression they see some Christians displaying against the homosexual community. Which I am completely against, love the person not the sin….which I know you agree with staks since you’ve said time and time again how its not the Christian you have the problem with but out beliefs…sorta the same thing.

    Often times (especially younger Christians like myself) people begin accepting homosexuality as ok because they know gay’s or they simply would not know how to act if they made it known they were against homosexuality. I am almost always labeled as a judging person….however I simply try to make my beliefs reflect that which God has revealed to us through scripture. I am not being judgmental against the person but merely adhering to a belief that God DOES condemn the lifestyle. However, the finger is usually pointed at me for being “intolerant” or “Close minded.”

  • http://www.dangeroustalk.net Staks

    The thing is that people often confuse sin with wrongdoing and there is a big difference. Sin is the separation from god, while wrongdoing is doing something immoral. Unless one is a Christian sin is meaningless. But when Christians say that homosexuality is immoral, that is where the problem comes into play because as a point of fact it isn’t.

  • http://twitter.com/Scone_Mason Scone_Mason

    By “they” you mean Bill Donahue and his computer, right? Maybe his right hand as well.

    • WetCoastAtheist

      Exactly! The Catholic League consists of Bill Donahue, his computer, and his website…. that’s it. Any one of us could give ourselves a high and mighty sounding title. Donahue is a creep.

  • http://rebelwithoutapplause.com Jon Perry

    Personally, religion is like a penis. I really don’t care what you do with it as long as you don’t shove it in my face.

    The fundies, radicals and those like Texas Governor Rick Perry scare the shit out me. It’s when douche bags like Gov Perry start screwing with or ignoring the Constitution. That’s my war on religion.

    Yesterday their was a blitzkrieg of social media activity because the Navy canceled their nativity festivities over an atheist complaint. It was another “War on Christmas”. I am fed up hearing about the War on Christmas. It’s like the War on Terror, War on Poverty, War on Drugs and War on Education. They are all bullshit and don’t work.

    Today’s War on Christmas is geared towards the U.S. Navy who directed service members serving in Bahrain to cancel and dismantle a “Live Nativity”.

    The Constitution is very clear. You CANNOT provide preferential treatment to ANY religion. No fundie is willing to answer the question, “What if the top billing this season was Hanukkah or Kwanza and Christmas wasn’t mentioned? What if in August all the bases decorated celebrating Ramadan?”

    What distresses me is that people WANT their rights, but SCREW other people’s.

    Bill Donahue is like Bill O’Reilly. They have a small target audience of listeners who are dying faster than new ones are entering the fray.